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Saw a thread on the Yahoo CC group about another school bus pump failure that cause loss of engine coolant and left owner stranded. I've not seen anything that looks like a coolant booster pump in the engine compartment but I may have missed it. Does every CC have one? Can any of you fellow Allure owners (especially 07) advise where I might find the culprit? I'd rather bypass it now than have it fail and leave me sitting on the roadside. We've not generally traveled in really cold weather but the Aqua Hot would certainly keep us warm in any case.
Not sure if your coach has one, but on my 02 Intrigue its located in the rear driver side, and its mounted on the inside frame. Mine went out on the drive home right after I purchased the coach. I could easily see the coolant leaking from my rear view camera, and spraying effect from the drivers side mirror. I pulled over and it continued to leak about another quart before it stopped. I lost about 2 gallons of coolant. A local shop came out and made a brass fitting to go in its place. I didn't replace the pump right away, and I could notice a big drop in heat from the dash. My advice is if you drive in temps below 40 degrees you would miss not having it. I now always carry that brass fitting with me as it is a very easy task to remove the pump and slide the brass fitting back into its place.
My pump is also on the drivers side next to the transmission. I get plenty of heat up front with the power disconnected from it (pump is still there just not powered). When I purchased the coach I replaced the heater hoses, flushed the cooling system and added new antifreeze. I also added four gate valves so I could shut down the dash heating and hydronic heating systems in case of failure. The power that used to go to the water pump is now used to power my Fass fuel pump. Bill
Don't know exactly where mine is but the chassis diagrams show it.
I just can't imagine how much work it would be to replace all the heater hoses on this beast. Unlike my previous coach where the frame rails (and everything that run along them) were exposed under the coach, the rails on this CC are completely covered by the ceilings in the storage compartments. I realize those ceilings can be removed for access, but it has still got to be a time consuming and difficult job. I suspect by the time mine need replacing, I will be too old to do it and will be paying someone a bunch of money to do it.
On an 08 magna its between the frame rails right above the driveline. The location sounds worse then it is. The shaft seal went out in mine and I replaced.
" I suspect by the time mine need replacing, I will be too old to do it and will be paying someone a bunch of money to do it." I know how you feel. No way could I change all my hoses
Yep, ours is the same, all covered and screwed in, not easily removable! Helped a friend with his Monaco and it was the same way. Working over my head while lying on the bottom of the bay is hard on me due to neck surgery I had.
I was under ours and it looks to me like the input seal on the drive axle is leaking. Not dripping yet but there is oil seepage.
My dash heat pump just failed on my 06 Magna, 58K miles, leaking seal. It is easy to remove the BR cover and access and bypass the pump, and pull the fuse to the pump (Iginition fuse box). It's all 3/4" heater hose, you can easily get the parts at any auto parts store. I recommend doing it, as it is not a matter of "if" it will fail, but "when" it will fail. And it is a bad failure, broken down on side of road with low coolant, engine shuts down. I am afraid the same "weak link" exists for the Hydro Hot engine preheat pump. I think plumbing in some gate valves there to bypass it in the event of failure would be a good idea too. The problem with the dash heat pump is it runs all of the time (when ignition on) and is located very close to the turbo. So the Hydro Hot engine preheat pump doesn't have these issues, may last much longer.
I disconnected the fuses for my school bus pumps some years ago. They will still fail and start leaking as I learned the hard way in the middle of nowhere in Idaho last year. I had it bypassed by a skinny guy who crawled on top of the engine since in my coach the engine access cover requires disassembling half the bedroom. I plan to remove the forward pump as well before it starts leaking. At least on my C12 powered 2002 Magna coach, these pumps are entirely unnecessary. I get lots of heat on the dash without them.
The rear bus pump on my 2000 Magna failed and cost me 15 gallons of antifreeze before I could get to Altofer CAT in Peoria, IL. I had them bypass the pump and continued on my way. The rear pump is above the transmission and easily reached by raising the bed. I have two pumps on my coach I need at least one of the pumps to get heat up front as I found out when I pulled the fuse and needed the defroster which didn't work. Also, my heated mirrors are connected to the same fuse and I had my mirrors fog. I have put a switch on the bus pumps so I can turn them off when not needed. This may not prevent a pump failure but I hope it helps. BTW. Altofer did great work for me and did the work to bypass the pumps at 9 pm so I could roll first thing in the morning.
I must be one of the lucky ones. I had changed the oil and filters and when i pulled it out of the shop i noticed the coolant leak on the floor. Yep the bus pump seal had gone south. Put in a by-pass pipe and ordered a new pump. I believe that was back in '10. Just saw the new pump again in the cabinet this morning as we are getting ready to head to cooler country. As others posted just really don't need this pump.
Without the pump, on a cold day, (say 30 F) how long does it take for the dash heat to start blowing hot air, and defroster working? Does it affect the mirrors?
Sounds like some people don't notice any difference at all when removing the pump. When I head south in winter I encounter temps in the 20's and 30's for the first day. I didn't replace mine right away, and I could notice a huge difference. It could be that my 400 ISL engine temp runs in the low 180's. My feet were a little cold, and just enough heat to stay comfortable. The first pump on my coach lasted 13 years and 65k miles, so I think its just best to carry a fitting to go in the pumps place when it fails, that way you won't be stranded. But as we all know there are hundreds of items that could fail and leave us stranded. Cruising down the road we should all keep an occasional eye on the back, and when mine failed it was very easy to notice.
On my old '99 I don't believe the mirrors have any heat. We have a ceramic heater we put between the front seats while in really cold country to warm the front and run the furnace while underway. The DW is usually snuggled on the couch sleeping while I am crusing down to warmer climates. Plus I don't like to get too warm driving as it makes it hard to stay awake.
Looking to see if I can locate the correct pump, this appears to be the correct one.
This is the location according to my manual.
Yes it is that back one, next to the turbo that is the killer. Bypass it, pull the fuse, avoid break down on side of road.
Brett - Do you know if your coach has two pumps? Wonder if the 36' CC's got by with just the one? We have two on our 40' Allure. Rear started leaking on our way South from Alaska. I pulled into a shop to ask for some help bypassing it. Anyways, the shop foreman of a truck repair shop, said no way they could get me into one of the bays. Said they had commitments to get the trucks I could see in the bays, and three others, back out to the companies that same day. But, he said if I'd be willing to wait, he'd at least get someone to look things over to confirm it was the pump. About 30 mins later, he came out himself with a crawler and flashlight and a pair of clean working overalls (With two or three of his crew looking out from inside the shop.) Asked me to raise the coach so his belly could clear (His words, not mine!) the under frame. He slid under, looked things over with the flashlight. Hit his ear piece blue tooth and called his own shop. Ask the receptionist to have Jr bring him a flat blade screw driver, and a (Forget the size.) socket wrench. Few minutes later, Jr delivered the two tools. And this gent proceeded to grunt, and groan his way up to reach the water pump. Snugged up on some clamps, dried things off with a rag. Then rolled out. He said his opinion was that it was leaking from an upper hose clamp, and running down over the pump body to make it look like the pump itself was leaking. Had me start the engine, turn on the heater, and said he'd be back in 20 minutes. 35 minutes later he was back out, I turned off the engine, he went back under, and I looked in from the engine bay access hatch. With a bright flashlight, you can just see the pump with the ISL combo.) Bone dry, no more leak. I checked my coolant tank and it was still in good shape fluid wise. (Had only been leaking a short period, I spotted it as I walked the coach during a fuel stop.). Took me almost as long to talk the gent into agreeing to take some funds for his time. He chuckled, and said it was worth it to him to have his crew see he could still do stuff!!! It being a Friday, I asked him if he and the crew ever had a few brews at the end of the week. And well, you know, he said they'd been known to do that! So, went across the street and bough them a case of beer that he said they enjoyed. (Was not Molson, Ehhh!) From when we stopped, until when were headed back out, just about 2 1/2 hours. It was two years later, in Sedona area, when mine started to leak at the actual pump itself. So, used the hose and clamps we had with us for such an occasion, and another gent charged me 30 mins work of labor to bypass the pump. Still sitting where it was. We saved the coolant that came out, and filtered it back into the tank. Doubt we lost more then 2-3 OZ's for the job. And, having traveled in mid to upper 20's, our front OTR heater still keeps us warm in the front. The front pump is doing all the work, and I've detected no reduction in heat.
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